What's a woman?

[Lori]

The male(s) in question know exactly what their chromosomes are and they know exactly the advantages they hold over female competitors. They will hide behind whatever lies work for them in order to beat these women up. They know the truth.

I presume they don't want to compete against men because they have less chance of winning. In other words, competition. Cowards.

[Hotrodder]

Of course, testosterone does not stimulate growth of breast tissues.

If they are good enough, they should be allowed to compete as males. I am not suggesting they are just banned.

The IOC seems to think that a doctor who failed to properly diagnose them at birth (understandably), and that as a result their sex was wrongly recorded in their documentation, is sufficient for these guys to compete as women.

Are there no gentialia evident at birth then? That would be my first point of reference.

[niemeyjt]

There would have been female external genitalia visible, I suspect - or at least an absence of developed male genitalia.

Without getting too detailed, in a male embryo there are additional developments where things "elongate" and move into different positions and then close up compared to the female.

Male and female start off the same during first few days and weeks of gestation.

[niemeyjt]

If they do treat these two as males for future OJ, maybe they should take up pole vault.

Should help them avoid this mishap

https://x.com/Glodyswotcher/status/1819673693897031898

[Bayleaf]

Brings a new meaning to the sport "Ball Trap"!

[Hotrodder]

Ouch!

[niemeyjt]

pole.jpeg

[Blaze]

I feel sympathetic for people who are born "different". They're scrutinised, judged and found guilty on social media without full knowledge of the facts. Journalists have a clever way of putting forward opinion people take as truth. Had Imane Khelif not gone in for a contact sport, she may never have been pilloried the way she is today. So far I have seen nothing that states - or proves - that she is transgender. Her only apparent "crime" is to have a higher testosterone level than that which is considered average for a woman - does this justify calling her a man ?

Many women have a higher than average testosterone level, it's just more controversial when they wish to compete in sports against other women. The higher testosterone level is what can give them the edge in strength and endurance.

Here is an interview with Imane Khelif : There is nothing particularly masculine about her, even her physique does not compare with Jessica Ennis Hill (see photo below)
https://www.theguardian.com/sport/video ... -row-video

The problems of gender testing are far from new. There's a very long but very interesting article on sportsmen and women and gender problems.
https://qnews.com.au/the-sordid-history ... pic-games/

The problems will continue until a conclusive way of determining whether someone is male or female is developed.

Jessica Ennis Hill

article-2360175-035AA6EA00000514-885_306x602.jpg

[exile]

I thought the IBF had done a blood test and identified XY chromosomes. I am no expert in this but is that not conclusive?

[suein56]

The problems will continue until a conclusive way of determining whether someone is male or female is developed.

It mentions in the second of your links that the 'female' under question was examined medically (quote) : 'Helen’s medical examination revealed the three proofs required to substantiate womanhood — a vagina, clitoris and…
…pubic hair!'
So, there you have it .. definitive medical proof
Perhaps this test should apply to any potentially female boxers in question in future ?

Edit : I agree with exile, who posted whilst I was writing.